cut shells
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cut shells
http://www.2ndamendmenttv.com/videos/shotguns/lost-arts-pt-1.html
I saw this on another forum and thought it interesting. Probably wouldn't work too well in an auto or a pump.
judgedelta- Established Poster

- Posts: 105
Join date: 2010-07-18
Re: cut shells
Cool demo etc,etc. However, when you force a larger projectile than the bore diameter down the bore, the breech pressure go up. You folks may want to try this but my common sense alarlm just went off. If you try this and have a bad result, please have your estate manager advertise your gun collection on this forum so we can help raise monies for your family.
doggoner- Veteran Poster

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Age: 69
Location: Perkinston, MS
Re: cut shells
My dad always called them 'ringers'. Nothing new.

3spop- Contributing Member

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Location: Clarksdale
Re: cut shells
Interesting ... plastic should compress very welll ...
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captain-03- Moderator

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Re: cut shells
Very dangerous. I have read that this practice causes 2X normal pressure.
Doug
Doug

Doug Bowser- Distinguished Poster

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Re: cut shells
Well if anything. They ruined a good bucket.

fastarrow- Distinguished Poster

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Location: Ocean Springs
Re: cut shells
Interesting. I'm too scared to try it tho.
Matt K- Veteran Poster

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Re: cut shells
I wouldn't ever try that or advocate doing so, but I thought it interesting. Just sayin...
judgedelta- Established Poster

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Join date: 2010-07-18
Re: cut shells
Doug Bowser wrote:Very dangerous. I have read that this practice causes 2X normal pressure.
Doug
just for conversation, let's say I've got a gun that will shoot 3-1/2" mags. Will a 2-3/4"
"cut shell" be over the 3-1/2"?????

Xd357- Moderator

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Re: cut shells
Xd357 wrote:Doug Bowser wrote:Very dangerous. I have read that this practice causes 2X normal pressure.
Doug
just for conversation, let's say I've got a gun that will shoot 3-1/2" mags. Will a 2-3/4"
"cut shell" be over the 3-1/2"?????
I do not believe that Doug is talking about the "Length" but rather the diameter of the shotshell. A 2 3/4 and a 3 1/2 shotshell both have the same diameter .... only difference is length to accommodate more shot. Pressure could rise when you force the plastic outer shell through the barrel rather than just the wad and shot going through it ....
_________________
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To be sure of hitting the target, shoot first
and call whatever you hit the target.
“Remember the first rule of gunfighting... ‘have a gun.’"
-Col. Jeff Cooper

captain-03- Moderator

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Location: Byram, MS
Re: cut shells
Right, I understand but do you think that the shorter shell "cut" will have more prerssure that the magnum?

Xd357- Moderator

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Re: cut shells
It seems that the weight of the shot charge and the amount of powder you have set off would both contribute to the pressure. I would think that a 2 3/4 shell would be foolish, or at least risky; a 3 1/3 incher (magnum load) would be almost a death wish. Good luck with that...
judgedelta- Established Poster

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Join date: 2010-07-18
Re: cut shells
Shotguns are not built with the safety factor that a centerfire rifle has. If you spike the pressure in a shotgun, I am sure there could be a catastrophic failure. The real problem is, the shotgun barrel usually bursts right where the non-shooting hand holds the forearm. The length of the shell has little to do with the pressure in the shell.
It is dangerous to shoot a 3" shell in a 2-3/4" chamber because the end of the star crimp folds into the barrel's forcing cone and the shot and wad has to force it's way past the unfolded crimp. I believe ringing a shotshell would create pressures greater than the use of a 3" shell in a 2-3/4" chamber. Thus causing a real problem. By the way, paper shells compress easier than plastic shells. I was given 6000 paper shells a few years ago and I have loaded them extensively. They are much softer than plastic shells.
Another old wives tail with shotguns is, removing the shot in a 12 ga shell and replacing it with dimes. This could be done with a cylinder bored gun but would cause high pressure in a full choked bore. Also the dimes will not fit in a modern shell with a shot cup plastic wad. It would work with an olde fashioned all paper wad with no shot cup. A shot cup wad would increase pressures as well.
Doug
It is dangerous to shoot a 3" shell in a 2-3/4" chamber because the end of the star crimp folds into the barrel's forcing cone and the shot and wad has to force it's way past the unfolded crimp. I believe ringing a shotshell would create pressures greater than the use of a 3" shell in a 2-3/4" chamber. Thus causing a real problem. By the way, paper shells compress easier than plastic shells. I was given 6000 paper shells a few years ago and I have loaded them extensively. They are much softer than plastic shells.
Another old wives tail with shotguns is, removing the shot in a 12 ga shell and replacing it with dimes. This could be done with a cylinder bored gun but would cause high pressure in a full choked bore. Also the dimes will not fit in a modern shell with a shot cup plastic wad. It would work with an olde fashioned all paper wad with no shot cup. A shot cup wad would increase pressures as well.
Doug
Last edited by Doug Bowser on Tue May 03, 2011 3:47 am; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : Typing sucks)

Doug Bowser- Distinguished Poster

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Re: cut shells
Wonder what kind of pattern you would get with dimes at 25 yds.?
judgedelta- Established Poster

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Re: cut shells
not good...i watched someone test it on some tv show, cant remember what it was but the pattern wasnt good at all
SHANE704- Established Poster

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Re: cut shells
It would seem that some people have never seen a failure in a firearm before.

mascott- Distinguished Poster

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Re: cut shells
Well, I can tell you. Today, I tried both wax slugs, and cut shells in my Maverick 88. I did pick up an Imp. Cyl. choke before I tried this.
The report: Both worked well, and no kaboom. I have an old oak tree that I use in the back yard for a backstop, and both burried about 2 1/2" - 3" in the old tree. I did recover one of the cut shells, and the wad was still with the shot and hull.
I was using 2 3/4" 7 1/2 shot for this. The one point I saw on another forum that made me feel a little bit better about trying this is the fact that the crimp is the safeguard, or the pressure relief for the cut shells. if pressures get too high, the crimp lets go, and the shot and wad leave the end of the gun. Now if this were to happen, the hull would remain, and be an obstruction.
This is not something I will be doing on a regular basis, but it does work.
Now for the wax slugs, HECK YEA, those should be no danger, and they do perform almost as well. From 25 yards into the old tree, I still only saw one hole, and burried quite deep. Trying to recover this, was well lets just say, I saw the mass of shot, but could not recover anything. they just fell into my hands.
What a blast.
Paul
The report: Both worked well, and no kaboom. I have an old oak tree that I use in the back yard for a backstop, and both burried about 2 1/2" - 3" in the old tree. I did recover one of the cut shells, and the wad was still with the shot and hull.
I was using 2 3/4" 7 1/2 shot for this. The one point I saw on another forum that made me feel a little bit better about trying this is the fact that the crimp is the safeguard, or the pressure relief for the cut shells. if pressures get too high, the crimp lets go, and the shot and wad leave the end of the gun. Now if this were to happen, the hull would remain, and be an obstruction.
This is not something I will be doing on a regular basis, but it does work.
Now for the wax slugs, HECK YEA, those should be no danger, and they do perform almost as well. From 25 yards into the old tree, I still only saw one hole, and burried quite deep. Trying to recover this, was well lets just say, I saw the mass of shot, but could not recover anything. they just fell into my hands.
What a blast.
Paul
Re: cut shells
The old load o' dimes trick can be found on the box of truth site.
This is where I would put the link if I knew how to do that fancy pants message board stuff.
This is where I would put the link if I knew how to do that fancy pants message board stuff.

Dr. 10/22- Full Poster

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Re: cut shells
This should cover the dimes in a shotgun mention earlier.
http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot35.htm
http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot35.htm

Scott T.- New Member

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Location: Currently Louisiana From Clinton Ms.
Re: cut shells
Xd357 wrote:Doug Bowser wrote:Very dangerous. I have read that this practice causes 2X normal pressure.
Doug
just for conversation, let's say I've got a gun that will shoot 3-1/2" mags. Will a 2-3/4"
"cut shell" be over the 3-1/2"?????
From what I can find, max SAAMI pressure specifications for 12 gauge is 11,500 psi for 2-3/4 and 3", and 14,000 psi for 3-1/2". So if what Doug read is correct and the pressure can be twice normal pressure for a 2-3/4", then obviously yes, it could be over 50% more than 3-1/2" max pressure.

DBChaffin- Distinguished Poster

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