CLASH OF METAL-MAN ON MAN RULES

How about this for an idea for new shooters that are not USPSA classified. Have Cliff shot 3 runs on the plates, take his average of the 3 runs to establishes a base line M class shooter. Now have each new unclassified shooter do 3 runs and take his/her average, see what % of Cliff's times they have and using USPSA classification rankings give them that classification.

JohnHeiter wrote:You caught me. You caught the Tater. I'm actually Master Class but I sandbag on the local, state, area, and national match levels. I'm saving up so I'll be the dark horse at the next World Shoot. Gonna make Grauffel my "b word" I can't say.

Saw the original "Tater Salad" live and in person last Saturday and you sir are no "Tater Salad", "Tater Tot" maybe.

I agree with XD and Sanders on the final 4 rules. I think I would prefer to use a consistent format throughout the entire match. Like someone said, if a new guy with nothing but a holster, gun, and 2 mags makes it to the final 4 they would be screwed on the reloading chip. You could let the final 4 vote on what format they wanted to finish out with.


Either way, I'll still be there spraying lead trying to beat Cliff and Steven

JohnHeiter wrote:You caught me. You caught the Tater. I'm actually Master Class but I sandbag on the local, state, area, and national match levels. I'm saving up so I'll be the dark horse at the next World Shoot. Gonna make Grauffel my "b word" I can't say.

Don't we have a shooter that does that every year at the MS Classic? Stays in UnClassified and has won in it 3 or 4 years in a row in Production?

We got a least one Tater-tot among us.

[quote="Cliff Cargill
Don't we have a shooter that does that every year at the MS Classic? Stays in UnClassified and has won in it 3 or 4 years in a row in Production?

We got a least one Tater-tot among us.


[/quote]


since this was directed at me, ill answer it.

i dont shoot the classic in unclassified because i want to, i do it because its the ONLY uspsa match i shoot all year. so yeah im unclassified. id rather be by "myself" in U class then be put in a class and beat someone that has put the time and the effort into shooting their best. if john wants to put an M by my name this year, im fine with that. i do it because i enjoy shooting and if i win a piece of wood im cool with that, i sure havent won any money. im not in it for the win, im in it for the fun.

I would suggest that you're not by "yourself" in Unclassified. There wouldn't be an award if there weren't at least three shooters in that division.

Also, there are a fair amount of new people in Unclassified, some of them jr. shooters. I've seen as many as 5 kids some years no matter who took home the "wood."

Guess I should explain the myself comment. I'm there for my own personal enjoyment so I'm shooting against myself.

To get back on topic, rick thanks for putting in the time and effort to come up with some written rules. Feel free to place me in any classification you feel necessary.

Rick, as you well know, the idea of classes is a nightmare. We've seen it at other matches that aren't connected with USPSA. Someone has to keep up with the data, and timed runs are the basis for such classes, which we don't have.

If someone won't give up plates to the under-classed shooter, I suggest we have a "Tater-Tot" rule whereby the line judge can make the call....

Yeah... "They call me...Tater....and I a'int givin' nobody nuttin'...."



Don't be a Tater-Tot....

Thanks for the inspiration, John!

With all these rules about classification and capacity coming up you might as well have holster handicaps also.

A competitor with a Singlestack or Production legal holster is at a disadvantage to a Revolver Shooter with some kind of Open Front Holster irregardless of that Revolver's lower round capacity.

In C of M draw to first hit time is critical.

Race holsters don't make THAT much difference truthfully.

I really don't see a need to unnecessarily complicate what should be a simple event with a classification system or divisions and what not. We are all adults. If you feel you are at a disadvantage skill wise, ask for a plate or two depending on how much disadvantage you perceive. The person you ask has the discretion to say yes or no, or agree to less plates. It's not a perfect system, and no system you try to implement will account for all the possibilities without making clash so burdensome to put on that it's just not worth it. KISS. That's what clash needs. Clarify the rules of operation in writing like its been done, and leave the handicap system alone. Treat it like common law..it's not written down, but it's understood. I have my own issues with a handicap system in and of itself, but I understand it's necessity.

atomicbrh wrote:With all these rules about classification and capacity coming up you might as well have holster handicaps also.

A competitor with a Singlestack or Production legal holster is at a disadvantage to a Revolver Shooter with some kind of Open Front Holster irregardless of that Revolver's lower round capacity.

In C of M draw to first hit time is critical.

Racer holster do make a difference if they didn't we wouldn't use them. I also agree with Justin " K-I-S-S."

atomicbrh wrote:With all these rules about classification and capacity coming up you might as well have holster handicaps also.

A competitor with a Singlestack or Production legal holster is at a disadvantage to a Revolver Shooter with some kind of Open Front Holster irregardless of that Revolver's lower round capacity.

In C of M draw to first hit time is critical.

Bobby,

Thanks for jumping in. As a shooter who uses a Blade-Tech Production rig I'm at no disadvantage against an open-front race holster. I know my draw times would be the same because I lift the gun straight up, and then out towards the target, and I think that's true with most shooters using proper technique. It fact, Matt Moorer won recently using a wheel-gun employing a non-race Blade-Tech holster for his wheel-gun.

We will have a simple set of rules the next match in hard copy form.

What shooters need to realize is Clash of Metal is there to improve your other shooting games, whether it's OutLaw Steel, ICORE or USPSA.

Competition shooters spend thousands of dollars on equipment every year that we perceive to give us an edge. Doesnt mean it always actually does . With race holsters, for most people, the difference is negligible. Unless you spend the time to develop your draw stroke to most effectively utilize its benefits, most people won't notice a difference because their muscle memory is a down and up stroke from a traditional holster. Where they can help, is when you are running long barreled guns like 6" 2011's or longer revolvers, but my understanding from other shooters, is that essentially the race holster in those cases prevents a handicap that a traditional holster might create.

I do not mind getting beat first thing by someone like Cliff, Tommy or any of the Moorers. All those people have paid their dues in the handgun sports many years ago and you can see it in their skill sets. They made the sacrifices to get where they are.

If I come up against those guys the first three times and get my three X's, I still have shot between 6 & 9 runs against the best. They come play my game with the standing rifle and the roles will be reversed. The rifle is where I made my sacrifices.

When I ask for a plate in C of M it is just to get a laugh or smile out of my competitors. I do not really want a plate. Just escaping the burdens of everyday life, problems and work by making someone else laugh.

I now see Clash of Metal getting really BIG in a hurry at Magnolia. There will soon be enough USPSA Production legal shooters to separate them into their own C of M Division.

I hope the Magnolia Board sees fit to purchase us more C of M specific targets and equipment. Hopefully crossed stop poppers. Getting the cross correct is the most time consuming, difficult part of setup.

Thanks Gale for stepping up to supervise this program.

Myers wrote:Competition shooters spend thousands of dollars on equipment every year that we perceive to give us an edge. Doesnt mean it always actually does ;). With race holsters, for most people, the difference is negligible. Unless you spend the time to develop your draw stroke to most effectively utilize its benefits, most people won't notice a difference because their muscle memory is a down and up stroke from a traditional holster. Where they can help, is when you are running long barreled guns like 6" 2011's or longer revolvers, but my understanding from other shooters, is that essentially the race holster in those cases prevents a handicap that a traditional holster might create.

I see what you mean, but its still there perceive or not.

The comment period for the new rules package is drawing to a close.

Scott and I would like to thank Golfer for all his hard work, and barring some safety issue, these will be in place until Feb 2013. At that point, shooters will once again be able to select club officers and the rules package can be revised if need be.

Cliff Cargill wrote:The comment period for the new rules package is drawing to a close.

Agreed - The purpose of this was to get some basic rules, and as has been said, to K.I.S.S. While I appreciate everybodies comments, we can't over engineer this. It may evolve in the future, we may be able to have classifications, etc and but for now we have the basics covered to be consistent. We'll bring a skirt and pumps for the better shooters that don't want to give up poppers to the less accomplished shooters, or the RO running the horm will handle by giving poppers when it is obvious that it is necessary. I learned a long time ago if you put 10 people in a room you will get 12 opinions, and we all know about opinions. That being said, thanks again to all for the interest and comments

[quote="Cliff Cargill]

As for the "FINAL FOUR", it's not unlike NASCAR'S "CHASE For The Championship". Just an element of excitement that shooters need to come try.[/quote]

Can you explain this as I'm not following you.

Points are reset....things change for the ending.